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opare

years after ETS surgery

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Hi, I did the ETS surgery a few years ago to deal with my blushing (face). I was very annoyed pretty much every day having to deal with blushing in several situations.

The first few weeks after the surgery felt great. You could feel how the heat stops around the chest area not going up to the head. But something changed

After that it changed into one-sided heating feelings/blushing that I still live with today. My doctor and other medical examinations didn't lead to anything specific.

My question now to all the people that have done the surgery, have you felt something similar? its like one-sided blushing that can switch sides depending on how you slept. which side.

I will describe it one more time: on-sided blushing and sometimes odd feeling of pressure back of the head. together with some sensible/red skin on that or both sides.

My doctor has never confirmed that it could be a possible side effect after the surgery. the surgery itself was done with cutting through the nerves, I think there are methods where they get clamped too.

As I'm struggling with this without any answers from the doctors I would welcome any answers from people that may feel something similar.

Thank you

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On 5/5/2019 at 4:38 PM, Buster said:

Hi Opare,

What nerves did you get cut and with which doctor... may help others answer your questions

hey Buster, sure

t2 and it was at the university hospital in Zurich Switzerland.

Any information related around that could help me

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@opare
Now a days, it is my understanding that surgeons chose to go for what some call extended T2 (Or T2 + T3). This to make sure all pathways from the overactive nervous system gets dealt with (Including the so called Kuntz nerves). 
Whether you chose cutting or clamping, the results should be somewhat the same (Although, clamping provides a significant greater chance for reversal, should you get severe side effects). 
If you have no problems with side effects now, a re-operation where all necessary nerves are dealt with, should not create a lot more side effects. 
I have written a lot about side effects, and pros and cons of the surgery here in a topic I started, if you need more information: http://esfbchannel.invisionzone.com/topic/4079-kprf-red-cheeks-questions-and-my-facial-blushing-story/page/7/
Cheers, and good luck! :)

 

 

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@blushingman

thx a lot. How are you dealing with it at this very moment? When did you have the surgery?

All Ive read some people have re done the surgery to remove the clamps. Not someone re do it after a few years cutting them. Do you?

I think Ive found the problems I'm dealing with is Neurogetic Rosacea. Not sure if it actually is a thing from the surgery. Talking about it in a different forum.

I'm still waiting for my surgeon to answer. Mind you my surgery was 2012. I think I've already asked him if you can re do it. We'll see

Kind of believe Accutane is more the reason for my Rosacea than it was the surgery. Anyhow flushing is kinda back

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@opare
No problem :)
I had the surgery done almost a year ago, and couldn't be happier with the result. You can read about it in the link I mentioned 
I have heard of some re-does, when the surgery did not work as expected (And not giving severe side effects). In your case, I Imagine trying T3 as well (Kuntz nerves). Whether you chose clamping or cutting, is up to you. 
Also remember, the survey is not intended for Rosacea, or any other skin disorders of permanent redness. Nor is it intended for flushing. It is aimed for those dealing with chronic blushing. For Rosacea there are no real cures, but people do find help with creams, medications and lasers. 
Good luck! :)

 

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21 hours ago, blushingman said:

@opare
No problem :)
I had the surgery done almost a year ago, and couldn't be happier with the result. You can read about it in the link I mentioned 
I have heard of some re-does, when the surgery did not work as expected (And not giving severe side effects). In your case, I Imagine trying T3 as well (Kuntz nerves). Whether you chose clamping or cutting, is up to you. 
Also remember, the survey is not intended for Rosacea, or any other skin disorders of permanent redness. Nor is it intended for flushing. It is aimed for those dealing with chronic blushing. For Rosacea there are no real cures, but people do find help with creams, medications and lasers. 
Good luck! :)

 

appreciate that. I might ask my surgeon about that. Fact is I can't live like this and have been depressed long enough. I dont have a problem with some comp. sweating rom the first surgery but my state now 7 years on is not ok.

Btw the people that did it. Why did they do it? Blushing, Sweating? How did it go for them? 

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@opare
No problem :) Yeah, I fully get that. Great that you do not have any side effects from the surgery! 
The surgery is intended for chronic blushing and/or chronic hand sweating. Whether you get this because of inheritance or environment is not clear. My guess is that it is due to a combination of the two. 

 

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2 hours ago, blushingman said:

@opare
No problem :) Yeah, I fully get that. Great that you do not have any side effects from the surgery! 
The surgery is intended for chronic blushing and/or chronic hand sweating. Whether you get this because of inheritance or environment is not clear. My guess is that it is due to a combination of the two. 

 

I fully agree. Finally my surgeon answered and I asked him about t3, he said usually thats something for sweating than flushing but at least he ordered an appointement. 

I'm fully aware of my condition probably won't be solved if I would cut t3 (no clamping imo) but 1 why do I only get the sensitive feeling only on one side of my face, on the side I slept (cant sleep on the back) it stays like that pretty much throughout the day, and 2 flushing is coming back both cheeks more and more.

As I'm not reacting well to any meds and there might be a slight relief from it why the hell not. It literally cant get much worse than it is. Struggling and more and more isolated myself for years. Do t2 and t3 do the same? or how do they different which nerv(es) to operate on? 

Thank you

Edited by opare

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Yes. T3 is for chronic sweating, and T2 is for chronic blushing. However, the pathway of the overactive nervous system can also go through the so called Kuntz nerves, which is closer to T3. Therefor, today a lot of surgeons also go through with T3 (or close, called extended T2) for chronic blushing. 
But like I have said, this surgery is for curing chronic blushing, not flushing or Rosacea. I would look more into lasers, creams and medications for Rosacea, although know that there unfortunately yet are no cures, only ways of reducing it. 
Cheers :)

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2 hours ago, blushingman said:

Yes. T3 is for chronic sweating, and T2 is for chronic blushing. However, the pathway of the overactive nervous system can also go through the so called Kuntz nerves, which is closer to T3. Therefor, today a lot of surgeons also go through with T3 (or close, called extended T2) for chronic blushing. 
But like I have said, this surgery is for curing chronic blushing, not flushing or Rosacea. I would look more into lasers, creams and medications for Rosacea, although know that there unfortunately yet are no cures, only ways of reducing it. 
Cheers :)

Appreciate it, did not know that. Are there more than these two within a ETS surgery?

If that is how they differentiate from blushing and sweating it is actually my hands that stopped sweating since the surgery, which means these nerves are combined at some level? my hands are dry still to this day.

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The surgery is only intended for these two medical conditions. If you mean T-levels, then no. Back in the days, they also did everything from T1 to T5, which created horrible side effects, and also did not make the result any better.
Yes, operating on T2 will also be able to cure hand sweating. However, T2 can sometimes create a little more side effects, so people who only struggle with chronic hand sweating usually only go for T3 (Since operating on that alone usually cures hand sweating). 

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thx! I will see what the doctor says. Do you know of any posibility that cut nerves could grow back? some way? Or is the sole reason for clamping that you can reserve it if wished?

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I have heard some stories of people claiming that. I even heard a surgeon saying that he had a patient who said the symptoms came back after cutting (many years later), so he had a re-do operation. But this is not certain, and if so, extremely rare. But, for me, it made clamping a bit more attractive. A part from this, the main reason for clamping is the possibility of reversal. 
Cheers :)

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On 5/23/2019 at 5:53 PM, blushingman said:

I have heard some stories of people claiming that. I even heard a surgeon saying that he had a patient who said the symptoms came back after cutting (many years later), so he had a re-do operation. But this is not certain, and if so, extremely rare. But, for me, it made clamping a bit more attractive. A part from this, the main reason for clamping is the possibility of reversal. 
Cheers :)

man all of this really is fu**** up, it might be time the robots take over ;) I wonder if you can see pre surgery how the nerves are currently? For me t2 are they still cut off 7 years later. probably not I guess

@blushingman

 

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@blushingmanwhat I want to add is too apparently ets surgery only helps against blushing? but in my case it clearly helped against flushing for ex. I could train indoors without getting red but before my head would turn red like crazy.

Isnt that something that is not blushing? 

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17 hours ago, opare said:

@blushingmanwhat I want to add is too apparently ets surgery only helps against blushing? but in my case it clearly helped against flushing for ex. I could train indoors without getting red but before my head would turn red like crazy.

Isnt that something that is not blushing? 

Great! 
I have heard of some that get that positive effect of the surgery as well. The surgery however is not intended for that. 
Yes, that is flushing, not blushing. 

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@blushingman

Thx.

May I ask for my appointment now this Friday is there anything you would recommend me asking? In the first reply you told me maybe not all necessary nerves got cut. I cant lie a second op would really scare me out 😕

Do you know of any other forums or plattforms people talk about ets? I would like to ask some more people about my symptoms.

Btw have you heard about Low Dose Naltrexone?

Thx in advance.

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@opare

Hi again :)

No, I don't think I have something additional to add. Like I have said. If you have not had extended T2 (Also called T2 + T3), then that might help. But again, from what you have written, it sounds more like Rosacea than chronic blushing, and the surgery will not cure Rosacea. 

This is the forum I know to be the best where the language is English. 

No, I have never heard of that. After a quick Google search, I don't see how this should help chronic blushing. 

Good luck, cheers :)

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6 hours ago, blushingman said:

@opare

Hi again :)

No, I don't think I have something additional to add. Like I have said. If you have not had extended T2 (Also called T2 + T3), then that might help. But again, from what you have written, it sounds more like Rosacea than chronic blushing, and the surgery will not cure Rosacea. 

This is the forum I know to be the best where the language is English. 

No, I have never heard of that. After a quick Google search, I don't see how this should help chronic blushing. 

Good luck, cheers :)

Thx. Ive informed myself pretty deeply lately about all this.

Btw you sure you dont want to get your clamps removed asap? You seem like a reasonable guy and the possible side effects you might suffer even in 5, 10 years from now could be life changing. I don't want to scare you or anything but you are still "fresh" and I would never have done the surgery never knowing if there is a health problem if it is from ETS or not. Yes you can remove the clamps later but even that healing process might take years if even.

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Np :)
There are no possible side effects down the line. This a very common surgery for chronic blushing and hand sweating. There have been done thousands of these surgeries over the years, and the procedure has been perfected. The satisfaction rate is 95 %. If you get side effects you do not like, you should see this the first month, and then be able to remove the clamps. 

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@blushingmanBut how about me ?

I think i have both of them - blushing and flushing. And i think that was connected because both of them are caused by overractive nerve (too much blood to face in some situations).

So, except classic blushing situations my face also going red when i'm exposed to high or low temperatures, when exercising ..

But i have found story from one man who had ets surgery about two years ago (he also have same problems like me) and he said after ets he can't go red even when he stands on his head - i think this is proof that the blushing and flushing are related.

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